Pipebombs OP?

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Pipebombs OP?

Post by Machiavellus on July 25th 2012, 9:50 pm

Well even the confogl version we have now, has no natural horde, so really the pipebomb has become much more powerful

Since some people want mollies removed, how do you feel about pipebombs? We've only been getting one, but previously we had more zombies to deal with. Now with less zombies do you think that pipebombs give survivors an advantage they don't need?

It's a get out of hitman free card. As well as a highly useful tool for rushing forward to a new spot while a tank is up. And there's basically no downside to throwing your pipe besides maybe, using it at the wrong time, but even then you're not really punished except in the way that, the other team may use their pipebomb at the right time, and have a free pass through a large horde.

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Re: Pipebombs OP?

Post by Rain on July 25th 2012, 10:16 pm

How about you guys don't shoot female boomers either? or You can only shoot every 3rd zombie.

At least try out the updated version of Confogl for what it is (once it's release) before suggesting all these dumb restrictions based on past games.

90% of teams don't make safe rooms now even with all pipebomb/bilebomb/molotov/gascans enabled. Pipebombs aren't as game changing as molotovs are either.

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Re: Pipebombs OP?

Post by Machiavellus on July 25th 2012, 10:32 pm

The two examples you offer as similar situations are ridiculous.

I'm not "suggesting" aimless restrictions based on "past games"

I'm trying to conclude to a ruleset that the whole community can agree on.

I'm putting the ideas in their head now. So when the mutation update comes, people can re-evaluate what was being discussed.

I already posted in another thread that MK is trying to do away with superfluous rules. My personal preference for rules is to just play the mutation as is, minus the parish finale.

Furthermore no one believes more than me, that even with HR, no natural horde and molly, people will still get tank wiped.

And yes pipebombs are utterly game changing. Especially when you consider that now, the only real horde that will be a task for survivors is boomer horde. A pipebomb nullifies a boomer horde, which during a tough tank fight, can make or break a team.

I just want to see how people feel about pipebombs now. So I can compare that with how people feel about pipebombs after the mutation update. Smile
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Re: Pipebombs OP?

Post by Rain on July 26th 2012, 9:22 pm

Machiavellus wrote:The two examples you offer as similar situations are ridiculous.

I'm glad you thought so since that was their intended purpose.

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Re: Pipebombs OP?

Post by Glitch on July 26th 2012, 11:19 pm

Eh, it's one per map. Doesn't really bother me, I say leave it.
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Re: Pipebombs OP?

Post by dave14810 on July 27th 2012, 1:01 am

I would like at some point to not be playing with any throwables but I agree that we need to play with everything at first and then we can make adjustments. My preferences would be mollies removed first, then remove the pipebomb and boomer bile and finally begin to scale back on health item pick ups but that is probably a long way from happening.

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Re: Pipebombs OP?

Post by Machiavellus on July 27th 2012, 3:08 am

Personally I'm quite happy with the pro/con ratio for a bilebomb. I don't really think we'll ever see the need to remove them. There's a lot that can go wrong with a badly thrown bile olol

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Re: Pipebombs OP?

Post by L2Aim on July 27th 2012, 7:50 pm

ALL THROWABLES.
4 PILLS.
So dumb.
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Re: Pipebombs OP?

Post by dave14810 on July 27th 2012, 8:33 pm

Yeah I mean I don't have that much against the boomer bile, I just thought if we would eventually get rid of the molly and the pipebomb we might as well get rid of all throwables.

@L2Aim Most people who weren't totally with the idea of taking all health have at least agreed to try it and see how it goes. Anyone else still against trying it comes across as a deathracer and is just afraid that all health will make the game more competitive.

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Re: Pipebombs OP?

Post by Foxtwins7 on July 27th 2012, 8:54 pm

@dave Whatchya saying about Cosby? He's a deathracer and is afraid of a more competitive game? If you are, you sadly mistaken and are stupid Smile. 4pills is plenty enough health for game with no natural horde and a HR. Do you realise we used 4 pills in the previous seasons and people still made saferoom? I've been playing games and making saferoom a lot with starter pills only. You add 3 pills and an extra shot is not going to make this game more competitive. Cosby nor I are not against play with all health but would RATHER play starter pills only. I think teams that vs eachother should be allowed to decide the rules.
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Re: Pipebombs OP?

Post by L2Aim on July 27th 2012, 9:01 pm

Competitive how?
It's pretty much tank wipe or nothing.
Which puts WAY more pressure on a tank,
not to mention the add of sniper.
If you played recently, and honestly, you probably haven't;
you would see how 4 pills is legit all you need.
Why are you assuming the maps are like 200 miles long?
Only reason I could see people taking more than 4 pills is that they don't know how to kill special, and they are getting hit by every SI hit possible, besides that;
We, I, don't need any extra pills.

As for pipe bomb, there is no real need to get rid of it.
There is only 1, and sometimes teams don't even have one.
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Re: Pipebombs OP?

Post by SlidingPeak on July 27th 2012, 9:18 pm

L2Aim wrote:Competitive how?
It's pretty much tank wipe or nothing.
Which puts WAY more pressure on a tank,
not to mention the add of sniper.
If you played recently, and honestly, you probably haven't;
you would see how 4 pills is legit all you need.
Why are you assuming the maps are like 200 miles long?
Only reason I could see people taking more than 4 pills is that they don't know how to kill special, and they are getting hit by every SI hit possible, besides that;
We, I, don't need any extra pills.

As for pipe bomb, there is no real need to get rid of it.
There is only 1, and sometimes teams don't even have one.


Me Tony Bren & BP played Crystal and Legend yesterday, neither of us made any maps, honestly.
Partly due to the fact that my team has been inactive as fuarrrk.
BUT, still.
Come on, I know you haven't played my team and I doubt you're making maps on Weedy.

So who are these savage L4D2 pros that you're making maps on?
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Re: Pipebombs OP?

Post by SlidingPeak on July 27th 2012, 9:20 pm

SlidingPeak wrote:Anyone in this thread can 4v4 me tonight with BP Tony Bren or Unreal

Make 2 maps and I'll try my best to get Mach to make it SPO.

You ALL suck L2 make saferooms.
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Re: Pipebombs OP?

Post by L2Aim on July 27th 2012, 9:23 pm

SlidingPeak wrote:
L2Aim wrote:Competitive how?
It's pretty much tank wipe or nothing.
Which puts WAY more pressure on a tank,
not to mention the add of sniper.
If you played recently, and honestly, you probably haven't;
you would see how 4 pills is legit all you need.
Why are you assuming the maps are like 200 miles long?
Only reason I could see people taking more than 4 pills is that they don't know how to kill special, and they are getting hit by every SI hit possible, besides that;
We, I, don't need any extra pills.

As for pipe bomb, there is no real need to get rid of it.
There is only 1, and sometimes teams don't even have one.


Me Tony Bren & BP played Crystal and Legend yesterday, neither of us made any maps, honestly.
Partly due to the fact that my team has been inactive as fuarrrk.
BUT, still.
Come on, I know you haven't played my team and I doubt you're making maps on Weedy.

So who are these savage L4D2 pros that you're making maps on?

Ask weedy.
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Re: Pipebombs OP?

Post by SlidingPeak on July 27th 2012, 9:24 pm

Not friends with him , next time I play him I'll get around to it...

4v4 me tonight , I don't think I got shit to do.
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Re: Pipebombs OP?

Post by Foxtwins7 on July 27th 2012, 9:26 pm

We made maps on weedy yesterday actually. And Mount Murders team we both made saferoom on eachother. Mounts team is defititely good btw.
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Re: Pipebombs OP?

Post by L2Aim on July 27th 2012, 9:26 pm

SlidingPeak wrote:
SlidingPeak wrote:Anyone in this thread can 4v4 me tonight with BP Tony Bren or Unreal

Make 2 maps and I'll try my best to get Mach to make it SPO.

You ALL suck L2 make saferooms.

ney, mach doesn't have a say in any of this.
If anybody, mk does;
and IF ANYTHING, the community does.
Since when has this become a Dictatorship?
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Re: Pipebombs OP?

Post by L2Aim on July 27th 2012, 9:28 pm

We could 4v4 tonight; sure.
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Re: Pipebombs OP?

Post by Machiavellus on July 27th 2012, 9:31 pm

Alright.

1.) Tank wipes or nothing is the way L4D2 is -supposed- to work. Without quad caps, that is supposed to be the only reliable kill.

2.) 3 secure + boom can still kill.

3.) Again you can still work a team down with your tank and wipe them with SI attacks. 4 -more- pills is only enough to fend off one decent attack on each survivors. With pills spawning randomly in every possible spawn, very few teams are going to end up fully equipped, regardless of circumstances.

4.) Playing now is not playing during the tournament. New confogl bumps back melee fatigue further and drops most gas cans.

5.) Why do you keep ignoring no spitter during tank? This is a huge buff for SI. Anyone who has a good tank knows how important good support is.

Saying it's 'pretty much tank wipe or nothing' is literally -exactly- how this game is designed to play at top level. The tank is the only thing capable of working down survivors.

SI are not supposed to be nearly ASSURED A WIPE, by 75% of the map, just by going in and landing mediocre attacks.

No matter the platform. The best teams take chip to their health. On xbox chip tends to be a little more substantial, and on xbox all the good teams are capable of wearing down every other team almost every other time, simply working the survivors over with chip, and landing a charge/spit.

The personal attacks are going to stop though. Or your team won't be allowed to participate in balance discussions.

But while that's still fresh in your mind. You may be convinced that -you- don't need pills.

But your team does. You have died regularly, and lost regularly, on every version of confogl. You died even more regularly on regular versus, back when we still played that.

The only reason you should ever need only 4 sets of pills. Is a team full of fail SI. Even a pub tank can work a survivor team over enough to get an easy wipe a few feet later with SI support.

It only takes 1 person to get hit by one charge spit. For all your pills to end up gobbled up. And some charge spits are nearly unavoidable with multi-SI set-ups. You can get hit once big, and by the late tank spawn, you will have eaten most of your pills, even if you shut down every other attack.

So settle down and stop trying to keep the community from evolving.

Or I guess you could go on pretending tanks aren't supposed to be the main obstacle.

"It's pretty much tank wipe or nothing."

It's funny because, that is how tanks are designed to work. When you look at what all the SI are capable of, the tank is the only one designed to actually wipe a team. Besides that, every good teams knows when playing another good team, that if your tank fails, your chances of wiping the opponent team decrease greatly.

So please settle down and stop arguing moot points with a guy who has been playing L4D since before you were out of Primary school. Wink
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Re: Pipebombs OP?

Post by L2Aim on July 27th 2012, 9:34 pm

I'm not reading that,


1) It's too long

2) Probably all stupid anyway.

and Mach,
To make valid points, you need to play the game.
You talk as if everything goes perfectly.
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Re: Pipebombs OP?

Post by SlidingPeak on July 27th 2012, 9:34 pm

L2Aim wrote:
SlidingPeak wrote:
SlidingPeak wrote:Anyone in this thread can 4v4 me tonight with BP Tony Bren or Unreal

Make 2 maps and I'll try my best to get Mach to make it SPO.

You ALL suck L2 make saferooms.

ney, mach doesn't have a say in any of this.
If anybody, mk does;
and IF ANYTHING, the community does.
Since when has this become a Dictatorship?


Mannnnnnnnn.
You really haven't been around in this community too long lol.
It always has been.
Even since GB the admins were the omnificent voice, doing the greater good for the community.


Just give the all health thing a go, clearly if they can change the SPO to all pills they can revert back, make a fucking point by playing. Make all maps, all the time.
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Re: Pipebombs OP?

Post by L2Aim on July 27th 2012, 9:40 pm

SlidingPeak wrote:
L2Aim wrote:
SlidingPeak wrote:
SlidingPeak wrote:Anyone in this thread can 4v4 me tonight with BP Tony Bren or Unreal

Make 2 maps and I'll try my best to get Mach to make it SPO.

You ALL suck L2 make saferooms.

ney, mach doesn't have a say in any of this.
If anybody, mk does;
and IF ANYTHING, the community does.
Since when has this become a Dictatorship?


Mannnnnnnnn.
You really haven't been around in this community too long lol.
It always has been.
Even since GB the admins were the omnificent voice, doing the greater good for the community.


Just give the all health thing a go, clearly if they can change the SPO to all pills they can revert back, make a fucking point by playing. Make all maps, all the time.

Since GB, this community has went to shit.
There is way too little people in this community to real shit,
and thinking you have a higher vote than anybody else is shit.
And HONESTLY, i could careless about this tournament, season or whatever.
I think of it as a way to get games with ease, but if the rules are gay, I could just play 4v4s with my own rules, it doesn't make a difference.
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Re: Pipebombs OP?

Post by L2Aim on July 27th 2012, 9:42 pm

Machiavellus wrote:
But your team does. You have died regularly, and lost regularly, on every version of confogl. You died even more regularly on regular versus, back when we still played that.



LMFAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
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Re: Pipebombs OP?

Post by Machiavellus on July 27th 2012, 9:43 pm

There's actually only one person in this tournament whose say matters more than mine.

That's MK.

And I hate to burst your bubble, but a true democracy isn't even possible. Someone always ends up unhappy with something. That's why modern democracies elect officials. You have to have someone "in charge" or everyone will just pick and choose rules that work the best for their team.

But since all I do is offer near perfect linear scenarios, I guess I'm a bad admin right?

If you think my scenarios are too linear, it is because you are simply -not thinking for yourself- My scenarios are outlines. Details may be changed, and I'll be looking into disallowing you in the rules forum later this afternoon. You are no longer contributing to this thread. Merely trying to derail it.
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Re: Pipebombs OP?

Post by SlidingPeak on July 27th 2012, 9:48 pm

L2Aim wrote:
SlidingPeak wrote:
L2Aim wrote:
SlidingPeak wrote:
SlidingPeak wrote:Anyone in this thread can 4v4 me tonight with BP Tony Bren or Unreal

Make 2 maps and I'll try my best to get Mach to make it SPO.

You ALL suck L2 make saferooms.

ney, mach doesn't have a say in any of this.
If anybody, mk does;
and IF ANYTHING, the community does.
Since when has this become a Dictatorship?


Mannnnnnnnn.
You really haven't been around in this community too long lol.
It always has been.
Even since GB the admins were the omnificent voice, doing the greater good for the community.


Just give the all health thing a go, clearly if they can change the SPO to all pills they can revert back, make a fucking point by playing. Make all maps, all the time.

Since GB, this community has went to shit.
There is way too little people in this community to real shit,
and thinking you have a higher vote than anybody else is shit.
And HONESTLY, i could careless about this tournament, season or whatever.
I think of it as a way to get games with ease, but if the rules are gay, I could just play 4v4s with my own rules, it doesn't make a difference.



4v4s suck. I don't feel they are anywhere near as competitive.
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Re: Pipebombs OP?

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